Pure Parents

Question:

The kids don’t feel that way at all.  They know that I care deeply for them and that it is my responsibility to provide all the safety that I can for them.  They know that once they turn 18, they’re on their own but, for now, I have to answer for what they get involved in, legally.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hi Jay >  > I likewise monitor their web caches and their ICQ histories. > I would *hate* that being done to me! It is nice for people to have a > trusting relationship, privacy if privacy is wanted, and control over > one’s own life. Is there something different about children? At what age > do they become ‘people’? > Vivienne

Response:

>Hi Jay > I likewise monitor their web caches and their ICQ histories. >I would *hate* that being done to me! It is nice for people to have a >trusting relationship, privacy if privacy is wanted, and control over >one’s own life. Is there something different about children? At what age >do they become ‘people’? >Vivienne

And it only works until they learn to empty the cache and delete the history files themselves anyway. Dorothy There is no sound, no cry in all the world that can be heard unless someone listens .. source unknown

Response:

> You stated that I can’t restrict what my kids learn to what I want them to > learn. Of course I can! What do you think makes cults so effective. The > human mind is amazingly controllable; frighteningly so. There is a wealth of > highly potent information and graphical presentation online just waiting to > present itself to anyone who will look for it or stumble across it.

You are pretending people, kids, are like legos, which can be plugged in anywhere interchangably, and they aren’t!! People do not COME as pre-formed sucker-consumers ready to latch on to any supposed truth, even lies. They can only be MADE that way by being made NEEDY in human emotional vectors which are not being met by their parenting. A newborn is WAAAY too much trouble for a cult to go through most of the time, or like the catholic church they’d merely try to "out-breed" the competition!! That sort of strategy requires a long-lived infrastructure and a false-truth which is much subtler and more insidious. > I want to teach my children to think critically and discern what is > wholesome and what is trash, but I also want to give them the best, safest > shot at this I can. Just throwing my hands up and saying, "Oh well. I guess > there’s no sense even trying because if they don’t get it here they’ll get > it somewhere else," is lazy parenting.

Be prepared to discover that YOU will ALSO be subject to any such scrutiny, and that they may not agree with you!! That is always the "danger" that parental fascists are secretly avoiding. Steve

Response:

> Vivienne, > You sound like a late 60s free-love flower child.

And so that’s your best epithet to call someone who disagress with you? > My children do not feel "big-brothered" or restricted in any way.

As if they would TELL you!! > In fact > the eldest (15) is very appreciative of the filtering I am doing.

He’d BETTER be, right?? Think about it! > He knows > what is right and what is wrong.

You seem to imagine futilely that "right and wrong" are precisely as you imagine them, AND that HE agrees with you!! You’re REALLY going to be surprised!! You’re the kind of wacko who even might become family annihilator when you finally see the truth!! > He also knows he does not have enough > self-control at his age to combat his inner urges.

He’ll figure out your sick little game shortly. > So his reaction (and the > other four also) is substantially different than yours. He thanked me.

Your son has no nuts of his own, I take it. You’re cruising for an extreme disappointment when these kids discover the world, if not getting your jaw smacked into next week. > Certainly I openly discuss moral/ethical and wise/foolish issues with them. > However, having done so does not in any way alleviate my responsibility as > their father to run interference for them.

Let me guess: You discuss, they listen. Sick, and unsustainable! > The question "when they become people" is silly and irrelevant.

No, the question is when do YOU honor them sufficiently to care what they think, instead of only what YOU think!! > The real > question is, at what point are they totally responsible for their own > decisions and environment. The answer is … when they move out on their > own.

In other words you’re teaching them to walk and run by holding their legs for them and moving them in a precise manner known only to you!! They will not be prepared to do this themselves when they are finally forced to. > Until that time, I am their guardian and protector. I am responsible > for helping mould and shape them into young men and women who are equipped > to survive and be successful in the world.

And you’re a nutcake!! A real fruit-loop!! Nobody with a brain speaks that way anymore! How stilted!! You’re a real fucking Major Burns!! You’re destined to make them so angry with you that when they figure out what you did to them they will simply give up altogether! They will do EVERYTHING you never wanted, and your version of reality will be seen as a bad joke in VERY poor taste upon them! > To assert (as you did below) that a 5 year old should have "control over his > own life" is completely absurd. I don’t even think my 15 year old should > have "control over his own life." That is why his driver’s license says > "Restricted." Even the government doesn’t believe he has that much control.

And what is your excuse when he is 16 and in command of a two ton vehicle at 100 feet per second?? Don’t let’s quibble over legalistic inanities, the rights of humans are all the same. > It is the same reason parents are held responsible for their minor > children’s actions. That is why they are called "minors." That’s why we > don’t let them buy alcohol or cigarettes. That’s why they can’t see R and > NC-17 movies. > I believe, Vivienne, you’re talking with your emotions and not your head. > Your position, while it sounds concerned and compassionate, is really > foolish and unsustainable. > Sorry.

It is YOUR position that is unsustainable, as you will shortly discover. If you haven’t damaged your children beyond even curiosity, then you will see them, or they will see their children go on to do precisely other, different, and opposite things than what you are trying to brainwash them with. Trying to control other people never has worked for long politically, and it won’t work with your family either. Steve

Response:

Hi > You sound like a late 60s free-love flower child.

Does that make a difference to whether you take my theory seriously? Would it matter if I were a child or a Holocaust survivor or whatever? > My children do not feel "big-brothered" or restricted in any way.

Then that’s fine but if they don’t feel restricted in any way, then why do you feel you must restrict them? It sounds like your children would do the same thing as they are now doing without the restrictions.   >He also knows he does not have enough > self-control at his age to combat his inner urges.

Why does he have to combat them? What harm would happen to him if he didn’t? I’m not sure what we are talking about here – is it looking at pictures or something else? >So his reaction (and the > other four also) is substantially different than yours. He thanked me.

He thanked you for restricting him but he does not feel restricted ? That could be I guess. > Certainly I openly discuss moral/ethical and wise/foolish issues with them.

Maybe that’s the answer. Your children do not feel restricted and would do the same things whether or not there was control because you have openly discussed the issues with them and given them your point of view. The children trust you and therefore do not feel restricted as they would not behave otherwise even if you did not control them. Maybe – of course I can only guess. But it sound like you have a great relationship with them. > However, having done so does not in any way alleviate my responsibility as > their father to run interference for them.

Which means? > The question "when they become people" is silly and irrelevant.

Not for me as I believe they are people from the moment they are born. Children are great thinkers and they can think unhampered by the types of hangups adults have. They are missing knowledge and experience. I believe this is what we as parents must provide. We must give them the knowledge to make their own reasoned decisions. > The real > question is, at what point are they totally responsible for their own > decisions and environment. The answer is … when they move out on their > own.

That is *your* answer. In some homes the children are very much part of the decision making process of what goes on in the family home as the decisions and the environment affect their life in a major way. They are in no position to leave if they don’t like it. There are some parents who want to make sure their children like it. >Until that time, I am their guardian and protector.

There are different types of guardians and protectors as there are different types of bosses. There are some bosses who encourage you to be part of the decision making process and some who wield control and make sure you know your place and a whole bunch in between the two. > I am responsible > for helping mould and shape them into young men and women who are equipped > to survive and be successful in the world.

I think this is where we differ most. I believe that I am fallible and can make mistakes. I have changed my mind over things that I once felt were self-evident truths. What if your mould will be damaging to them? What if it’s a mould they do not easily fit in? They can still grow up to survive and be successful in the world without that control. They need knowledge more than control. Knowledge will give them self control as with it, they will know the reasons that *they* made the decisions. > To assert (as you did below) that a 5 year old should have "control over his > own life" is completely absurd.

I didn’t know we were talking about a 5 year old but it would still hold true. Why can a 5 year old not make decisions that affect his life when he has you as an advisor and he trusts that you are always on his side trying to find a way to safely and responsibly let him do what he most wants to do. We are not talking about a child alone in the world. We are talking about a child that has his parents as his most trusted advisors.  >I don’t even think my 15 year old should > have "control over his own life."

He shouldn’t unless he wanted to. > That is why his driver’s license says > "Restricted." Even the government doesn’t believe he has that much control. > It is the same reason parents are held responsible for their minor > children’s actions. That is why they are called "minors." That’s why we > don’t let them buy alcohol or cigarettes. That’s why they can’t see R and > NC-17 movies.

Governments make laws – sometimes good laws, sometimes bad. In any case, when we were discussing internet access, I didn’t think we were discussing laws about it. Are there any laws in children having uncontrolled internet access? > I believe, Vivienne, you’re talking with your emotions and not your head.

Why? Which part is emotional ? I just think it is far better for children to have self control than to be controlled. > Your position, while it sounds concerned and compassionate, is really > foolish and unsustainable.

Which part is foolish ? It might only be unsustainable because it is a very time consuming way of bringing up children – sharing knowledge, sharing experiences, helping them do the things they want safely (sometimes this takes a lot of creativity). I think it’s worth it. You may not and that’s okay.  > Sorry. You don’t have to be. Vivienne

Response:

Hi Jay > The kids don’t feel that way at all.

That’s great. > They know that I care deeply for them > and that it is my responsibility to provide all the safety that I can for > them.

Most parents feel that way. I don’t think most parents would want to *intentionally* hurt their child. What safety are we talking about ? You say you monitor their web caches. Are some web sites unsafe for them? Maybe an example would help me understand. > They know that once they turn 18, they’re on their own but, for now, > I have to answer for what they get involved in, legally.

I think I must be missing something. DJGray said something similar. Is there a law that prohibits internet access for children? Vivienne

Response:

> It is YOUR position that is unsustainable, as you will shortly discover. > If you haven’t damaged your children beyond even curiosity, then you > will see them, or they will see their children go on to do precisely > other, different, and opposite things than what you are trying to > brainwash them with. Trying to control other people never has worked for > long politically, and it won’t work with your family either.

Steve, There was so much in your post that was based on assumption and conjecture, as well as taking my statements out of context that I’m not even going to address them all. Additionally, if you want to "attack" my positions, that is fine. I can deal with that. However, you have attacked me personally and that’s not okay. We have never even met. You haven’t any idea who I am, what I’m like,  or what my life is like. If you are doing this just to get a charge out of it and feel powerful, that is your business, and I’ll serve as your punching bag for a time. You come across as a man full of bitterness and anger. It would seem you have had some bad experiences yourself which bring you to this point. I’m sorry if that is the case. Let me assure you, my relationship with all five of my children (three sons and two daughters) is exemplary. We are open and honest with each other. They are all deeply loved and well cared for. They know that I would die for them to protect them if need be. They do not fear for their safety. We are a very tight-knit family, with "game nights" and "junk-food night (a favorite with the kids!)" and family trips to local parks and rivers and beaches, etc. We play "family basketball" in the driveway and have cul-de-sac parties with the neighbors. My kids are good kids because they choose to be, not because they are forced. We are surrounded by elderly folks in our neighborhood, and the kids just love them to pieces. They will frequently go visiting with the neighbors, because they like it, and the neighbors love having them around. We work together on the house and on the yard. We are currently building a treehouse together when weather permits and as we are able to gather up "junk wood." My youngest son and I, just last evening, built an "egg-drop-box" for a contest coming up on Saturday at the company picnic. The box will be dropped from 40 feet and the egg can’t break. We were testing it by dropping it off the upper deck into the back yard last night. We had a blast trying different things to keep the egg from breaking. Again, my youngest son loves me so much (we were the only ones home last evening) that he asked if he could take some money out of his savings and take me out to dinner last night. It was precious! The two oldest are straight A students. They are both involved in Premiere League soccer and are captains of their teams. The eldest was just elected as Vice-President of his sophomore class in a school of almost 2000 students. He was voted as Homecoming Royalty his freshman year, and was voted "Most Trustworthy Student – Class 2003." He was the starting cornerback on the football team and also played on special teams. He works as a tutor at school, teaching the parents of his schoolmates how to use computers. He works at church every Wednesday evening with special-needs children. The two oldest boys have each served their schools as conflict mediators. My oldest daughter spends about 15 hours a week volunteering at an Alzheimer’s residential care unit. My oldest son has served for the last four years on the Student Leadership Council in middle and high school. He was voted by the faculty and staff as the Outstanding Male Student of the Year two years ago. All five of the children are budding musicians; some of them playing multiple instruments. They all sing, and we sing as a family on occasion. I don’t push my children to do ANY of these things. They do it of their own volition, simply by following the example of their parents. There are times that example falters, something Vivienne pointed out in her post. We are far from perfect parents, but there is no question in the minds of our children that we are genuine! When we make errors in judgment, and that judgment affects the children, we will sit down with them, explain what happened and ask them to forgive us. I’ve done this numerous times with my children, and it is a tremendous bonding experience to have your CHILD forgive YOU! I teach my kids everything I can from combing their hair to good manners to writing software to hanging drywall. I teach them how to look at life with awe and wonder and to see the beauty and majesty in a snowcapped mountain, and how to laugh with people when things are funny. I teach them the importance of family and honor and integrity. I teach them the value of serving others and treating them with respect and dignity. I teach them to see situations and discern if what they are seeing and hearing is true and accurate. I volunteer time at their school and attend all their plays and concerts and games. My wife and I pray with and for our children on a daily basis. We are both deeply affectionate with our children. They are held, hugged and kissed in abundance. Not many teenagers are comfortable hugging their parents in public; especially a teenage boy and his father. Ours do, and it is their choice. Their joy is our joy, and their sorrow is our sorrow. My oldest son was so excited about getting his first driver’s license that the first thing he did was drove to my office, ran in, in the sight of everyone there, and showed it to me. The whole office got excited with us. Contrary to what you have thought and posted, Steve, I’m an awesome dad, and my kids would tell you so whether I was standing there or not. I’m so very sorry if you did not have that as you were growing up.

Response:

Hi > Steve, > You come across as a man full of bitterness and anger.  

That’s not the way he came across to me. Vivienne

Response:

No, there is no law, but you would sure be held accountable if your child shared pornography discovered on the internet, or maybe bomb making recipes, or was e-mailing someone intent on harming them. Kids don’t necessarily have the judgment to be let out alone in society and not monitoring them on the net is just that.  I get porn links in my e-mail that are unsolicited, what if my five year old clicked on one of those? Sorry, but kids need to be supervised on-line. KarenM.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hi Jay > The kids don’t feel that way at all. > That’s great. > They know that I care deeply for them > and that it is my responsibility to provide all the safety that I can for > them. > Most parents feel that way. I don’t think most parents would want to > *intentionally* hurt their child. What safety are we talking about ? You > say you monitor their web caches. Are some web sites unsafe for them? > Maybe an example would help me understand. > They know that once they turn 18, they’re on their own but, for now, > I have to answer for what they get involved in, legally. > I think I must be missing something. DJGray said something similar. Is > there a law that prohibits internet access for children? > Vivienne

Response:

Hi Karen > No, there is no law, but you would sure be held accountable if your child > shared pornography discovered on the internet, or maybe bomb making recipes, > or was e-mailing someone intent on harming them.

I’m sure parents talk to children. There is nothing wrong with telling them the above. There are many things that are against the law – like stealing from stores, for example. We share this with the children and most don’t do it. There is no surveillance camera that follows them around wherever they go. >Kids don’t necessarily have > the judgment to be let out alone in society

They are not alone. You are there every step of the way advising them and sharing your knowledge and ideas with them and sharing things that interest them. > and not monitoring them on the > net is just that.

I disagree. You are there and you share with them and they trust you enough that they share with you.  > I get porn links in my e-mail that are unsolicited, what > if my five year old clicked on one of those?

What if she/he did? They probably would have no interest. If children did, then would be the time to discuss porn with them – not have it as a forbidden subject. How are you monitoring your five year old on the net, anyway? > Sorry, but kids need to be supervised on-line.

I know of many responsible families that don’t supervise their kids on line. These families believe that protecting their children is best done by the children having knowledge of ‘dangerous things’ and knowing how to protect themselves.   Vivienne

Response:

Hi Jay

 > I likewise monitor their web caches and their ICQ histories. I would *hate* that being done to me! It is nice for people to have a trusting relationship, privacy if privacy is wanted, and control over one’s own life. Is there something different about children? At what age do they become ‘people’? Vivienne

Response:

Vivienne, You sound like a late 60s free-love flower child. My children do not feel "big-brothered" or restricted in any way. In fact the eldest (15) is very appreciative of the filtering I am doing. He knows what is right and what is wrong. He also knows he does not have enough self-control at his age to combat his inner urges. So his reaction (and the other four also) is substantially different than yours. He thanked me. Certainly I openly discuss moral/ethical and wise/foolish issues with them. However, having done so does not in any way alleviate my responsibility as their father to run interference for them. The question "when they become people" is silly and irrelevant. The real question is, at what point are they totally responsible for their own decisions and environment. The answer is … when they move out on their own. Until that time, I am their guardian and protector. I am responsible for helping mould and shape them into young men and women who are equipped to survive and be successful in the world. To assert (as you did below) that a 5 year old should have "control over his own life" is completely absurd. I don’t even think my 15 year old should have "control over his own life." That is why his driver’s license says "Restricted." Even the government doesn’t believe he has that much control. It is the same reason parents are held responsible for their minor children’s actions. That is why they are called "minors." That’s why we don’t let them buy alcohol or cigarettes. That’s why they can’t see R and NC-17 movies. I believe, Vivienne, you’re talking with your emotions and not your head. Your position, while it sounds concerned and compassionate, is really foolish and unsustainable. Sorry.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hi Jay >  > I likewise monitor their web caches and their ICQ histories. > I would *hate* that being done to me! It is nice for people to have a > trusting relationship, privacy if privacy is wanted, and control over > one’s own life. Is there something different about children? At what age > do they become ‘people’? > Vivienne

Response:

Rosalie, I realize it was an intentionally sarcastic answer. However, sarcasm can often be brilliant! Not in this case however. I still maintain that it was a stupid answer and was unnecessary. Perhaps Lin’s original question indicates a bit of over-protection and paranoia, nonetheless I respect her desire to protect her 8 year old son from harmful availabilities on the net. As a software developer, I am constantly obtaining older, outdated hardware, and all five of my kids have their own computer system in their bedroom, and all are networked through one gateway to the internet. I assure you I exercise control and monitor what is going in and out of that gateway. Any responsible parent would do no less. You stated that I can’t restrict what my kids learn to what I want them to learn. Of course I can! What do you think makes cults so effective. The human mind is amazingly controllable; frighteningly so. There is a wealth of highly potent information and graphical presentation online just waiting to present itself to anyone who will look for it or stumble across it. I want to teach my children to think critically and discern what is wholesome and what is trash, but I also want to give them the best, safest shot at this I can. Just throwing my hands up and saying, "Oh well. I guess there’s no sense even trying because if they don’t get it here they’ll get it somewhere else," is lazy parenting.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->"> No, sadly learning cannot be restricted to what you like. Why he might >> learn something you don’t want him to know! You’d better just kill him >> now and be done with it. >> Steve >What a stupid answer! > Yes, but it was stupid on purpose.  He often posts stuff like that – > it is sarcasm. > In fact, except for his solution, it is true.  You can’t restrict what > kids learn to what you want them to learn, especially once they start > school.  Even homeschooled kids will probably learn stuff their > parents don’t like. > grandma Rosalie

Response:

I have to fully concur with you, DJ, on that.  I have a similar setup at home and have taken the time to explain such things to my sons as well, ages 10 and 13.  I likewise monitor their web caches and their ICQ histories.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Rosalie, > I realize it was an intentionally sarcastic answer. However, sarcasm can > often be brilliant! Not in this case however. I still maintain that it was a > stupid answer and was unnecessary. > Perhaps Lin’s original question indicates a bit of over-protection and > paranoia, nonetheless I respect her desire to protect her 8 year old son > from harmful availabilities on the net. > As a software developer, I am constantly obtaining older, outdated hardware, > and all five of my kids have their own computer system in their bedroom, and > all are networked through one gateway to the internet. I assure you I > exercise control and monitor what is going in and out of that gateway. Any > responsible parent would do no less. > You stated that I can’t restrict what my kids learn to what I want them to > learn. Of course I can! What do you think makes cults so effective. The > human mind is amazingly controllable; frighteningly so. There is a wealth of > highly potent information and graphical presentation online just waiting to > present itself to anyone who will look for it or stumble across it. > I want to teach my children to think critically and discern what is > wholesome and what is trash, but I also want to give them the best, safest > shot at this I can. Just throwing my hands up and saying, "Oh well. I guess > there’s no sense even trying because if they don’t get it here they’ll get > it somewhere else," is lazy parenting. > >"> No, sadly learning cannot be restricted to what you like. Why he might > >> learn something you don’t want him to know! You’d better just kill him > >> now and be done with it. > >> Steve > >What a stupid answer! > Yes, but it was stupid on purpose.  He often posts stuff like that – > it is sarcasm. > In fact, except for his solution, it is true.  You can’t restrict what > kids learn to what you want them to learn, especially once they start > school.  Even homeschooled kids will probably learn stuff their > parents don’t like. > grandma Rosalie

Response:

Hi

 >I assure you I > exercise control and monitor what is going in and out of that gateway. Any > responsible parent would do no less.

I know responsible parents who do it differently. > You stated that I can’t restrict what my kids learn to what I want them to > learn. Of course I can!

Of course you can restrict kids from doing anything. You have far more power than they do. It doesn’t follow though that this is the right thing to do.     >There is a wealth of > highly potent information and graphical presentation online just waiting to > present itself to anyone who will look for it or stumble across it.

If this interests the child, then I would think that you could discuss it with him. Forbidden things seem to create far more interest in people. If something was not forbidden your child might or might not have an interest. If they do have an interest, it would be very good to discuss this with them and to offer your thoughts and theories on the subject. > I want to teach my children to think critically and discern what is > wholesome and what is trash,

Assisting them by sharing your thoughts and theories with them would seem like a good way to help them think critically. Controlling what they see, isn’t teaching them to think critically. > Just throwing my hands up and saying, "Oh well. I guess > there’s no sense even trying because if they don’t get it here they’ll get > it somewhere else," is lazy parenting.

I don’t think anyone suggested this approach. Vivienne – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >"> No, sadly learning cannot be restricted to what you like. Why he might > >> learn something you don’t want him to know! You’d better just kill him > >> now and be done with it. > >> Steve > >What a stupid answer! > Yes, but it was stupid on purpose.  He often posts stuff like that – > it is sarcasm. > In fact, except for his solution, it is true.  You can’t restrict what > kids learn to what you want them to learn, especially once they start > school.  Even homeschooled kids will probably learn stuff their > parents don’t like. > grandma Rosalie

Response:

Unfortunately there is no way to ensure a child surfing alone will not see unsuitable material.  However, if you were to sit along side him while he does his research you may be able to direct him away from material that is not child safe.  As for his poll, that can be easily done without him being mailed responses.  If you are familiar with html, make a webpage for him at any of the free hosting services. If you don’t know html, the children at my school have easily made home pages at Homestead.com. It is free and fast, and no html is required. Homestead will set you up (a parent must register for the site for any child under 13) with a free email address,  and provide a free poll that he can use for his mock election, a guestbook or a coolboard(forum). He could set this whole thing up in an hour or two.  As for interacting with people on the internet, I too was hesitant about giving my son full access. I explained the real danger kids can face on the internet to him and how he should handle different situations that may come up. I’m glad that I finally gave in as he has met some other great kids that have similar interests as well as a few adults that have chatted with him about his different hobbies and interests.  Eight years old is a little young for chat rooms and forums  but what about letting him chat with friends with AIM or Yahoo im’s.  You can use the high security options, and he will enjoy chatting with his friends from school or the neighborhood. My 6 year niece and her best friend chat on AIM, using the talk feature.  Each only has the other on their buddy list, but they feel grown up like their older brothers and sisters! Cathy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> My 8 year old son is taking a summer course that has a final project > coming up. He has chosen the presidential election as his topic, and he > wants to do the research for it entirely online, including conducting a > mock election. This is worrysome to me because he is not allowed to > access all areas of the internet, and he is not allowed to interact with > anybody online. And I don’t want to be giving out my address for people > to email with answers either. Is there an easy way for him to do his > research that is entirely safe? > -Lin

Response:

>My 8 year old son is taking a summer course that has a final project >coming up. He has chosen the presidential election as his topic, and he >wants to do the research for it entirely online, including conducting a >mock election. This is worrysome to me because he is not allowed to >access all areas of the internet, and he is not allowed to interact with >anybody online. And I don’t want to be giving out my address for people >to email with answers either. Is there an easy way for him to do his >research that is entirely safe? >-Lin

Nothing is entirely safe on the internet..  And the safest ways won’t get him the answers he needs for any kind of mock election. Question – what kinds of people is he interested in doing this with? One possiblity is to help him put up a website with the election parameters that people can vote in and then post the URL to various newsgroups with an explanation of what you are doing. People who wanted to participate could go to the website and vote and his counters could tally the results.   He could even have a guestbook or bulletin board for comments, I suppose. Dorothy There is no sound, no cry in all the world that can be heard unless someone listens .. source unknown

Response:

> My 8 year old son is taking a summer course that has a final project > coming up. He has chosen the presidential election as his topic, and he > wants to do the research for it entirely online, including conducting a > mock election. This is worrysome to me because he is not allowed to > access all areas of the internet, and he is not allowed to interact with > anybody online. And I don’t want to be giving out my address for people > to email with answers either. Is there an easy way for him to do his > research that is entirely safe? > -Lin

Lin, Why not set up a central location and invite people to visit it and share their opinions? That way, both sides remain anonymous. There are two ways I could conceive of doing this: 1. Use a survey site. Zoomerang.com is a really good one that has a free service you could use to create an election poll. Then you can post or email the URL and watch the results anonymously. 2. You can create a homepage. Geocities.com is probably the most popular way to do this. Add a guest book function and have people give their opinions there. Or post the survey URL there. As for the email worries, set up a Yahoo email account just for this project. You keep the password and your son can only access it when you are there. Hope that helps, Jacob

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> My 8 year old son is taking a summer course that has a final project > coming up. He has chosen the presidential election as his topic, and he > wants to do the research for it entirely online, including conducting a > mock election. This is worrysome to me because he is not allowed to > access all areas of the internet, and he is not allowed to interact with > anybody online. And I don’t want to be giving out my address for people > to email with answers either. Is there an easy way for him to do his > research that is entirely safe? > -Lin

No, sadly learning cannot be restricted to what you like. Why he might learn something you don’t want him to know! You’d better just kill him now and be done with it. Steve

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"> No, sadly learning cannot be restricted to what you like. Why he might > learn something you don’t want him to know! You’d better just kill him > now and be done with it. > Steve

What a stupid answer!

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>"> No, sadly learning cannot be restricted to what you like. Why he might > learn something you don’t want him to know! You’d better just kill him > now and be done with it. > Steve >What a stupid answer!

Yes, but it was stupid on purpose.  He often posts stuff like that – it is sarcasm. In fact, except for his solution, it is true.  You can’t restrict what kids learn to what you want them to learn, especially once they start school.  Even homeschooled kids will probably learn stuff their parents don’t like. grandma Rosalie

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Get him a web based email addy (hotmail, netscape) for the responses to his inquiries.  He’s 8, so he is going to need your help anyway.  There is no reason why he can’t do this without your supervision.  Supervision and assistance being the key here, then there is no reason to be worried. Sarah Mom to Kalen (9) and Victoria (8 months)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->My 8 year old son is taking a summer course that has a final project >coming up. He has chosen the presidential election as his topic, and he >wants to do the research for it entirely online, including conducting a >mock election. This is worrysome to me because he is not allowed to >access all areas of the internet, and he is not allowed to interact with >anybody online. And I don’t want to be giving out my address for people >to email with answers either. Is there an easy way for him to do his >research that is entirely safe? >-Lin > Nothing is entirely safe on the internet..  And the safest ways > won’t get him the answers he needs for any kind of mock election. > Question – what kinds of people is he interested in doing this with? > One possiblity is to help him put up a website with the election > parameters that people can vote in and then post the URL to > various newsgroups with an explanation of what you are doing. > People who wanted to participate could go to the website and > vote and his counters could tally the results.   He could even have > a guestbook or bulletin board for comments, I suppose. > Dorothy > There is no sound, no cry in all the world > that can be heard unless someone listens .. > source unknown

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what about a hotmail account, then at least you keep your normal one private, oh hang on, i see you use a yahoo, that might do the trick>? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> My 8 year old son is taking a summer course that has a final project > coming up. He has chosen the presidential election as his topic, and he > wants to do the research for it entirely online, including conducting a > mock election. This is worrysome to me because he is not allowed to > access all areas of the internet, and he is not allowed to interact with > anybody online. And I don’t want to be giving out my address for people > to email with answers either. Is there an easy way for him to do his > research that is entirely safe? > -Lin

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> what about a hotmail account, then at least you keep your normal one > private, oh hang on, i see you use a yahoo, that might do the trick>?

Hotmail also has a wizard to set up a web page with all kinds of features. I think you could even do a chat if you want too. In the questioneer when you are setting up your account you do not have to give the real info you can type in anything you want like John doe 1 any place, anywhere USA. etc – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> My 8 year old son is taking a summer course that has a final project > coming up. He has chosen the presidential election as his topic, and he > wants to do the research for it entirely online, including conducting a > mock election. This is worrysome to me because he is not allowed to > access all areas of the internet, and he is not allowed to interact with > anybody online. And I don’t want to be giving out my address for people > to email with answers either. Is there an easy way for him to do his > research that is entirely safe? > -Lin

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My 8 year old son is taking a summer course that has a final project coming up. He has chosen the presidential election as his topic, and he wants to do the research for it entirely online, including conducting a mock election. This is worrysome to me because he is not allowed to access all areas of the internet, and he is not allowed to interact with anybody online. And I don’t want to be giving out my address for people to email with answers either. Is there an easy way for him to do his research that is entirely safe? -Lin

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