Question:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Hi, gang: > I love a good laugh as much as anyone, but I’ve been concerned about >the direction that the newsgroup has taken lately, particularly after >hearing that children are being encouraged to access this site. Most >of the jokes have been obscene, and some of the threads have become >pretty raunchy. Would you really want your children or grandchildren >reading the stuff that has been posted lately? > Censorship is out of the question (I wouldn’t want it either), but a >little self-restraint may be in order here, so that the group is >appropriate for anyone desiring information or support. > What do you think? >Leslie
I have to say I agree. I don’t mean to sound prudish, though maybe I am, but I think the explosion of all this ‘xxx rated nasty joke’ stuff is a bit uncalled for…I neither have the time nor the inclination to read this stuff and to be honest, I don’t think so-called ‘nasty’ jokes are what this newsgroup is about. Just my opinion. — ruth arnold
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(post snipped) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Believe me, I’m no prude, but Kenny is right. This is not > an appropriate forum for XXX-rated jokes when so many > children have access to the site and there is no efficient > way to keep them from reading the jokes. Even you folks > who have no children around, or who do have the time to sit > with your children for a couple of hours a day while they > play on the computer, should realize that not everyone > enjoys the arrangement you have. Believing that constant, > and I mean CONSTANT, supervision is ever a good solution to > ANY child-rearing problem is naive, to put it kindly. Of > course you supervise all you can, but realizing how > demanding parenting can be, and how quick and sneaky kids > can be if they think there is sex info accessible, you also > make undesirable things difficult for kids to get at. > I’m with Kenny on this one. > Cush.
Wow, this is a first. I agree with Cush. I would like to see the X-rated jokes go somewhere else. They are most assuredly off topic and they add nothing to this NG, IMHO. Sexuality, in the context of arthritis, is a legitimate topic. But, that is not what is being posted. All of you who enjoy the crude jokes are free to go to a joke NG. There is no other NG available for those of us who want to discuss arthritis in an atmosphere free from pornography and crude jokes. (I am aware of M.H.A., but it is essentially dead as well). Hey, there’s an idea – all spam and crude jokes to M.H.A., everything on-topic post here! Walt
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Why not compromise have read I believe most of the jokes and feel generally not offended. However if there there is a chance that children are reading them…the real nasty ones should be discontinued. How about "clean" jokes, (they are out there, you know), some not using "4 letter words" or not necessarily pertaining to sexuality are just as amusing to me. But I do enjoy a chuckle now and then between the serious discussions of our illnesses. Nocki – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I am a Newbie so to speak, I have been lurking for awhile and have gotten alot > of help from my post here, I also have 3 children 11, 9,&8. I never allow my > children to be on the computer alone, even my 11 yr old is supervised, I don’t > consider this a waste of my time, after all it is my job as their parent and > further more it is also my Time, I try and allow them to use the computer when > I am ready. Sometimes during school this is hard and yes I may often have to > stop what I am doing and help with my son’s research, but that is rare, for the > most part it is on my time, not theirs, I also have a phone mic on my computer > so I don’t get called into the other room. > Since coming to this newsgroup I haven’t read any of the jokes that you all > are talking about, because I choose not too read them, I enjoy a joke as much > as the next one, but I have not read them here due to time restraints, however > if I choose to read them then I will, I have not been offended that they are > here. the choice is clearly yours to make! I also can understand your concern > Leslie, well just my two cents worth!! Hope I haven’t overstepped my bounds! > Jeanie
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Walt, no, please! How about if we all subscribe to the newsgroup: UW.JSAW I have no idea what it used to be. Something to do with the U. of Washington, I suppose. But it’s dead now. Dejanews show no posts to it in 1998 at all, and only 13 to in all of 1997, all of which were spams. (I don’t know why it gets so few spams – makes me wish we were "uw.support.arthritis"). Let’s hijack it! It’s simple. All jokes and other valuable 
but way-off-topic articles should, out of consideration for others, be posted there henceforth. (Unless someone has a better idea.) Cush. Walt Hanks wrote – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Wow, this is a first. I agree with Cush. I would like to see the >X-rated jokes go somewhere else. They are most assuredly off topic and >they add nothing to this NG, IMHO. Sexuality, in the context of >arthritis, is a legitimate topic. But, that is not what is being >posted. >All of you who enjoy the crude jokes are free to go to a joke NG. There >is no other NG available for those of us who want to discuss arthritis >in an atmosphere free from pornography and crude jokes. (I am aware of >M.H.A., but it is essentially dead as well). >Hey, there’s an idea – all spam and crude jokes to M.H.A., everything >on-topic post here!
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>Hey, there’s an idea – all spam and crude jokes to M.H.A., everything >on-topic post here!
We will never reach an agreement here folks. It aint gonna happen. Too many on both sides of the fence. If you want to do it that way Walt, then I suggest the other way around. alt.support.arthritis is a support group, and laughter and joking and teasing are part of support in my book. misc.health.arthritis is an info group. So put all the info there. You all know my opinion, I enjoy the jokes, the bantering and yes, even the crudeness. But I am also well informed and consider the advice I give to be good advice and the support I give seems to mean alot to many. And I will continue to do all three. If someone desires to report me to AOL for posting Support is much, much more than just medical info. Keep Jokin’ ~krissy "The most thoroughly wasted of all days is that in which one has not laughed." Nicolas Chamfort
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That may be easy for you, I’m not around all the time but I am a very good & conscientious parent (how many awards have you won!!). I become extremely upset with people who go off half cocked about how much control they have over their kids & their friends (who are often more worldwise than our own). We don’t have cleannet in our area yet but have signed up for it as soon as it is available. What the problem I see here is that most parents would assume that an educational NG about arthritis would be safe for their children to do homework or research etc.. Wrong!! I’m not saying to stop the jokes I’m upset because many conscientious parents would assume that this group is safe & I take offence at your jibes!!!!! My 10 year old looked up info. on the Spice Girls singing group & boy did we get the Spice Girls +++++, thankgoodnes we were there in the room, so it often doesn’t matter how careful you are these things happen .Susan
I always had enough parenting skills to control what my children were able to access. I just know there are a bunch of eight years trying to find ASA right now. Sheeeesss!!!! ~~~Kenny~~~
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Deebee 3 wrote > If this is what people want, fine by me. But I think
this "division" of LOL >support vs. information support is a bit drastic. I don’t remember anyone >saying *humor* was inappropriate; what’s been called into
debate lots of times >over the last few months is the subset of raunchy XXX nasty humor. > Since it’s just a subset that seems to be upsetting
folks, why not take it >into e-mail? That way no one has to move anywhere.
Dearest Deebee – I don’t think the e-mail idea is good because I, for one, feel like I’ve got enough stuff to delete from my e-mail box as it is, yet I want access to the jokes when and if I want it 
Also, the jokes are archived if we post them to an NG, and occasionally I need to go get one I read two months ago for some reason. Finally, it’d be too cumbersome for Bob and the other jokesters. Now, maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the big deal over having a raunchy joke/anything goes side-NG. I read a handful of NG’s now, including 2 arthritis NG’s. Why not have a third – *our* joke NG? Nobody has to *go* anywhere. It’ll will be the same folks there as are posting the jokes and replies to the jokes here, only now we/they can do it without even a twinge of conscience. Anyone who clicks there HAS asked for it. Now here’s the great part. I found several inactive NG’s: alt.gib alt.inner.circle alt.morons alt.rodney.king alt.wendy.broke.it uw.jsaw phil.jokes Take your pick. They are just sitting there for the taking. I posted test articles in all of them to be sure they work. If some folks’ ISP doesn’t carry the one we chose, we can try another. I like phil.jokes because it is easy to remember, has an unbelievably appropriate name, and Dejanews doesn’t have record of a single article EVER being posted there. Not even any spam! It’s ours for the taking. All we need to do is subscribe to it (takes me about 4 seconds with Internet Explorer 4.1 – I’ll be happy to post instructions for anyone who needs help subscribing), then we start joking our hearts out, the raunchier the better. We folks that read and post with kids looking over our shoulders can either not subscribe to phil.jokes, or else not unlock it with CyberPatrol except when we want to read there, yet we’ll have easy access to a.s.a. Also, I don’t like the idea of "moving" the raunchy stuff to m.h.a. because a lot of newbies find it before they find a.s.a., for one thing, and we may need to "move" the whole NG there someday (remember the "death of the alt hierarchy" discussion a couple of months ago?). But mostly, I just view m.h.a. as a health NG, like a.s.a., and I think health NG’s should be rated "G". Call me square. I repeat: this is NOT an attempt to "move" anyone anywhere. I see it as just building an addition onto our sandbox for the kids who feel like being naughty for a while to play in without fear of disturbing anyone else. Even when they’re in phil.jokes, they’re still right there, where we can see them. Can we just try it for a while? Isn’t fame worth *something* around here? <g> As Rodney King said, during his 15 minutes of fame, "People, can we get along?" Cush. P.S. Kinda makes you want to go for the alt.rodney.king choice, doesn’t it? P.P.S. I also admit to being exhilarated at the thought of hijacking a prize, I mean newsgroup, even if it is just a derelict. Reminds me of those old accountants-turned-pirates of the "Crimson Permanent Assurance" short-film at beginning of Monty Python’s _The Meaning of Life_. (Sorry D, I know you don’t approve of MP). P.P.P.S. How about it Porter ent, are you on board? Would you be willing to try putting the raunchy jokes there for a while, to see how it would work? The lawyer jokes would stay, of course, except when they get too colorful, too.
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I have kept quiet to this point, which you have to agree is a tough thing for me. LOL But this really is a serious matter. I came out in favor ( a while back ) to limit some of the off color jokes. Since that time, the material has become rauchier and rauchier. If we are taking a consensus of opinion here, then I like the idea that really rauchy stuff be posted somewhere else, or delivered in a manner that doesnt make it available to kids who happen to stop by. Porter, please dont feel that this debate is about you, because it isnt. We all appreciate your efforts to keep us all smiling. But you are pushing the x rated material a little too hard right now. There is lots of material out there that is G and PG. I post some of it myself. I have a friend that sends me lots of material, but I post only what I feel is appropriate for all eyes. If that is censorship, then so be it. But if it goes out with my name on it, it will meet my standards. Just my opinion. Char (o:]>*
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I’m with you – I’m getting tired of having to delete so many, many X rated jokes. I still have a young child around who likes to talk to me while I’m on the computer, & it’s difficult trying to control what she should never be exposed to. I’m glad to see your opinion because it has been pretty bad lately. Thanks Susan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Hi, gang: > I love a good laugh as much as anyone, but I’ve been concerned about >the direction that the newsgroup has taken lately, particularly after >hearing that children are being encouraged to access this site. Most >of the jokes have been obscene, and some of the threads have become >pretty raunchy. Would you really want your children or grandchildren >reading the stuff that has been posted lately? > Censorship is out of the question (I wouldn’t want it either), but a >little self-restraint may be in order here, so that the group is >appropriate for anyone desiring information or support. > What do you think? >Leslie
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I too am one of those newbies and have been lurking for some time. I have only posted a couple of times and many of you probably don’t even recognize my name but I had to put my two cents worth in. I love all the jokes here. I come for information when I read this newgroup but also enjoy the laughs and smiles I get when reading some of these threads. The banter and jokularity let me know that it is possible to laugh through all this pain. Surely the parents out there (and I am one too) have enough responsibility to monitor their childrens’ surfing. I know I do. The web can be a "scary" place out there and I have never allowed my girls to sign on without me present. If you do decide to change locals for the jokes etc. can someone please let me know how to find the new location since I am not entirely literate when it comes to newsgroups etc. Thanks to you all for you help, information and sense of fun. Barb
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(KrissyJo) writes: >If you want to do it that way Walt, then I suggest the other way around. >alt.support.arthritis is a support group, and laughter and joking and teasing >are part of support in my book. misc.health.arthritis is an info group. So >put >all the info there.
Dear Krissey, This is also, an interesting compromise answer. My mother used to say that one child cuts the sandwich and the other child gets to pick which half…if the LOL support is to be divided from the information support, we need to get consensus on who goes where. If Walt is chopping, then Krissey ought to get to choose. I like it better than this one: >UW.JSAW >I have no idea what it used to be. Something to do with >the U. of Washington, I suppose. But it’s dead now. >Dejanews show no posts to it in 1998 at all, and only 13 to >in all of 1997, all of which were spams. (I don’t know >why it gets so few spams – makes me wish we were >"uw.support.arthritis"). Let’s hijack it! >It’s simple. All jokes and other valuable but >way-off-topic articles should, out of consideration for >others, be posted there henceforth.
BTW, neither of these compromise positions are actually addressing the issue of what YOUR children are doing on the web…and this is still important. We have all heard the horror stories of children being taken advantage of by sociopaths who are stalking them on the web. Whether or not your child is exposed to risque humor has nothing to do with protecting them from "that nice man down the street, who wants to play computer games with me". With or without your supervision, your kids need to understand that they are in danger. And parental locks don’t always do any good if the bad guys are targeting children’s web pages. So stay alert to the bigger picture here and don’t get fooled into thinking that if you don’t read dirty jokes or visit porn sites, that your children are safe. Warm regards, Angela "Let the doctor take care to regulate the whole regimen of the patient’s life for joy and happiness, allowing his relatives and special friends to cheer him, and by having someone tell him jokes." Henri de Mondeville
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>Hey, there’s an idea – all spam and crude jokes to M.H.A., everything >on-topic post here! >Walt
Walt, I hate spam as bad as you do….why would we want to take spam with us? This is a compromise idea though…perhaps, we who want to enjoy adult jokes and don’t really relish all this conversation (didn’t I hear this thread last week…didn’t I hear it the week before?) regarding our rights as adults to exchange adult jokes could move: lock, stock and barrel (o’laughs) over to MHA which for all practical purposes is defunct. You sometimes readers of jokes could just drop in for a giggle and those of us who regularly read and post on both could just go on about our business doing it. But, if we – those of us who vociferously defend our rights to joke – agree to take our LOL’s across the street, you folks who stay behind are not to come knocking next week because your kids haven’t anything to read<g>! And obviously, I’m not the only one who needs to be convinced. I ain’t going if KJ and Kenny and Porter and Shelley and Hildagh and Char…all youse guys come with me. For one thing, I’d be lonely over there by myself and for another thing, we would need an all out effort to convince the last of the spammers to give over. Still, it’s an idea…let’s hear some discussion. Wouldn’t have to anyone go away mad or anything. I tend to think some of our on-topic topics are much more amusing with a bit of to and fro but, I’m not unreasonable. But let’s hurry up and solve this so that when I go away (Wednesday) from the computer, I’ll know where to come home to <g>! No moving away while I’m gone…I’d take that real personal! Warm regards, Angela "Let the doctor take care to regulate the whole regimen of the patient’s life for joy and happiness, allowing his relatives and special friends to cheer him, and by having someone tell him jokes." Henri de Mondeville
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>The problem is that I don’t have time, and would consider it >a waste of it even if I did, to sit with my 8 and 12 year >olds every minute of every day that they are on the computer >playing Oregon Trail, or one of their educational CD’s, or >checking out the World Cup site, etc.
Just different views in parenting I guess. I cant not imagine letting my children on the web without me there. And I use AOL’s parental controls and have very good kids…..but the web is a whole world. To me it is almost the same as letting them roam a big city alone. Supervising their time online is hardly a waste of time in my book. Once again, JMHO. Keep Smilin’ ~Krissy "The most thoroughly wasted of all days is that in which one has not laughed." Nicolas Chamfort
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Krissy – It isn’t nearly so scary with CyberPatrol. You can filter one way, which lets kids into any site that CyberPatrol or the parent has not black-listed, or you can set it so it lets kids into only the specific sites they have approved as appropriate to a six year old, and you can add to or subtract from the list if you want. When set up the latter way, I hardly see how that poses a threat to the kids. Moreover, the problem, as I see it, is not that parents are knowingly letting kids surf the net without supervision, it’s that kids sneak on when the parents are distracted. Well, duh, what do we expect? Of course they are going to do that. My 12 year old knew how to enter URL’s in the browser. I thought that was innocuous enough, and didn’t show him Yahoo! But then 2 boys in his 6th grade class told him to enter yahoo.com in the browser address box, then put a sexually graphic word in the search box once you got there. As soon as I was busy out in the yard for a bit, he tried it. On a hunch (the screen wasn’t blanked when I walked in) I checked my History file, and there were a bunch of strange URL’s listed. I could trace exactly where he had gone, page by page. He hadn’t gotten into any "good stuff" yet, but he was only seconds away from it when he heard the door open and exited.
>The problem is that I don’t have time, and would consider it >a waste of it even if I did, to sit with my 8 and 12 year >olds every minute of every day that they are on the computer >playing Oregon Trail, or one of their educational CD’s, or >checking out the World Cup site, etc. >Just different views in parenting I guess. I cant not imagine letting my >children on the web without me there. And I use AOL’s
parental controls and >have very good kids…..but the web is a whole world. To me it is almost the >same as letting them roam a big city alone. Supervising
their time online is – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->hardly a waste of time in my book. >Once again, JMHO. >Keep Smilin’ >~Krissy >"The most thoroughly wasted of all days is that > in which one has not laughed." Nicolas Chamfort
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Leslie wrote re: the xxx jokes/threads: Censorship is out of the question (I wouldn’t want it either), but a little self-restraint may be in order here, so that the group is appropriate for anyone desiring information or support. What do you think? Leslie, I think you’re absolutely right. Self-restraint isn’t that difficult to summon up, especially when one considers that what’s written here is accessible to the entire world (your boss, your priest, your MIL, your what-have-you). Seems to me that certain of the recent threads could have been taken to e-mail a long time ago so that folks could carry on to their hearts’ desires. But I’m not that concerned about kids stumbling in here. After all, some of our musings lately would make a horny seventh-grader feel right at home. What’s more important to me is what newbie *adults* with arthritis think as they peruse the offerings. Do they think it’s clever and join in or do they think they’ve wandered into Beavis and Butthead’s newsgroup and scurry away? I don’t know; maybe those new folks around will speak up as CaLupo and Chris already have. I do think that the group should be accessible to *everyone*, not just us old-timers who know which threads to ignore and who’s funnin’ whom. But I also know, Leslie, that, unfortunately, you can’t force self-restraint on anybody; otherwise, folks like Jerry Springer would be out of business. Thanks for initiating the dialogue, Denise
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I am a Newbie so to speak, I have been lurking for awhile and have gotten alot of help from my post here, I also have 3 children 11, 9,&8. I never allow my children to be on the computer alone, even my 11 yr old is supervised, I don’t consider this a waste of my time, after all it is my job as their parent and further more it is also my Time, I try and allow them to use the computer when I am ready. Sometimes during school this is hard and yes I may often have to stop what I am doing and help with my son’s research, but that is rare, for the most part it is on my time, not theirs, I also have a phone mic on my computer so I don’t get called into the other room. Since coming to this newsgroup I haven’t read any of the jokes that you all are talking about, because I choose not too read them, I enjoy a joke as much as the next one, but I have not read them here due to time restraints, however if I choose to read them then I will, I have not been offended that they are here. the choice is clearly yours to make! I also can understand your concern Leslie, well just my two cents worth!! Hope I haven’t overstepped my bounds! Jeanie
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Opps. Where was I? Anyway, I solved that problem by getting CyberPatrol. But unless I want to have CyberPatrol lock up a.s.a. with all the other NG’s, it is wide open to my kids. Like I say, I can lock and unlock a.s.a., or the entire Cyberpatrol program, and I do both at times, but that is a bit of a pain to do. I guess I don’t really mind locking and unlocking, but I also don’t think it is appropriate that people reading a heath NG should have to worry about their kids being attracted to emblazened, "XXX Nasty" headers on their screen if they walk into the other room for a minute. Cush.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Krissy – >It isn’t nearly so scary with CyberPatrol. You can filter >one way, which lets kids into any site that CyberPatrol or >the parent has not black-listed, or you can set it so it
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> I am one of those newbie adults, and I happen to like the variety of threads. > It’s nice to be able to laugh and forget about the disease for a moment while I > peruse through the jokes. I think getting off the subject can sometimes be a way > for us to get to know eachother, not just our diseases. It may make it easier > for us to support eachother if we know more about one another. I am enjoying > getting to know all your different personalities, it is what makes us unique and > interesting. Without all the variety we are all just a bunch of sick people, and > who wants to hang arouind sick people?
-Carol – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> What’s more important to me is what newbie *adults* with arthritis think as > they peruse the offerings. Do they think it’s clever and join in or do they > think they’ve wandered into Beavis and Butthead’s newsgroup and scurry away? > Denise
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I always had enough parenting skills to control what my children were able to access. I just know there are a bunch of eight years trying to find ASA right now. Sheeeesss!!!! ~~~Kenny~~~
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Well said KrissyJo, Both my kids go surf the net. At one time we had a computer in my son’s room with a modem. He would go in there and shut the door. This lasted about a month and the kids computer moved back into my office…..they don’t go on-line unless they ask and I am usually keeping an eye on them!! Yes!!!! As a parent I have to take responsibility for what they surf. I feel this same way about TV. Last night my son and I had a debate about the Simpsons, South Park, and one other cartoon which I forgot the name. I don’t them him watch those shows. I know he watches them sometimes at his friends, but talking with his friends parents not normally. My thoughts. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Would you really want your children or grandchildren >reading the stuff that has been posted lately? > As a parent, my children wouldnt be on the web without me looking over their > shoulder. They both have their own screen names and sign on frequently. But > never without me around. > That resposbility lies with the parents, not with us. > IMHO > Keep Smilin’ > ~krissy > "The most thoroughly wasted of all days is that > in which one has not laughed." Nicolas Chamfort
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problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong. The problem is that I don’t have time, and would consider it a waste of it even if I did, to sit with my 8 and 12 year olds every minute of every day that they are on the computer playing Oregon Trail, or one of their educational CD’s, or checking out the World Cup site, etc. Because of computer training in school, and from watching me, they know how to load the browser, which means they can also easily get into newsgroups. I also get called to the phone at times when I’m in the NG, so I have to leave it on the screen, visible to passing eyes, or else completely exit. I have CyberPatrol (I got it after some kids at school told my 6th grader how to find porno sites with Yahoo!, and I realized I better do something fast), so they cannot get into any NG I do not select as accessible, but it is a pain to go through the Unlock process for a NG. So my problem is that, while I couldn’t care less about adults passing whatever jokes they care to between them, and even enjoy reading some of the jokes when I have the time, posting them on the NG, "clearly marked as such," as some sensitive souls have demanded, creates a hazard for me I’d rather not deal with. And as if that wasn’t bad enough, now they going up in blue ink. One would think that an arthritis forum would be a safe thing for kids to be exposed to, except for an occasional porno spam with a crude header, but that is clearly not the case here anymore. And there is a simple solution that would solve the problem and create only minor inconvenience to the folks who want the dirty jokes delivered. There ARE "joke" NG’s. There are also hundreds of inactive NG’s out there, where nothing is being posted now, but which we could "seize" and post all the jokes we want to on. Then, anyone feeling like a risqu
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